Shockwave for Erectile Dysfunction

More and more men are having shockwave therapy to fix their erectile dysfunction, either at a clinic or self-administered. This is a forum to for men to discuss what experiences they have had, what treatment they used, and what results they obtained.  The goal is to get men to share their ideas, trials, successes and failures in order to help other men working to improve their mojo as well.

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9/23/2019 5:32 pm  #1


Possibly useful info

In this post I describe my second round of six sessions and the start of my third round.  In my ongoing SW experiment, I found answers to the questions, “How much is too much?” and “What happens after that?

Review

My first round of six sessions – two per week – used relatively high energy – 90mj – and low frequency – 3Hz using about 2200 shocks per session.  I used the largest hand piece attachment which is about 41mm diameter.   The result was of this round was excellent – it was though I rolled the clock back twenty years.  But, as I am sixty-eight, I was not at the level of a twenty-something.

I noted that for a day or two after each session that responsiveness and sensitivity was reduced.  The full effect of the six-session round did not kick in until almost three weeks after I finished the round.

Planning for Round Two

While I liked the result of round one, my feeling was that there was some unevenness.  In round one I positioned the hand piece at twelve o’clock (pointing straight down) at the base, mid-shaft and near the top for 500 shocks in each location.  I definitely felt some difference between the locations where the hand piece was used and other locations.   I thought it would be an improvement to use more locations on the shaft – to use the hand piece on each side directly above the corpus cavernosum (approximately two and ten o’clock).   I also wanted to experiment with more shocks.  Having no adverse effects with 2200 shocks per session, the round two plan was to start with 3600 shocks and see what happens.   Rather than give 500 shocks per location (except glans) the plan was for 400 shocks for most locations.

I saw no reason to change frequency setting, energy level or hand piece attachment.

Round Two

The first session worked out amazingly well.  Post-session, the immediate feeling was that the session felt more thorough and complete than the round one sessions.  Three days after the session, I had sensitivity I’ve not experienced for forty years.  It was one of those, “Too good to be true” feelings.  This would have been the right place to stop therapy.  Just end it.  Mission accomplished.

But no, I was thinking that “More is better,” and wondering what happens if I keep the number of shocks per location the same, but add more locations – top and each side.  So I decided on a plan with a total of 4400 shocks, still at 90mJ.  And this, gentlemen, was too much.

I lost a lot of sensitivity.  I wasn’t overly concerned in the moment as reduced sensitivity immediately after a session was my experience.  But unlike previous sessions the sensitivity didn’t come back by the next session.  Also there was tenderness the day after the session.  However, there was no pain at all, either during or after the session.

It was clear this was too much, so for the remaining four sessions – two weeks – of the round I dialed back to the level of the first session of round two.  But the damage was done.  Instead of hard erections, I had tissue paper.  In those sessions I increased the frequency to 4Hz from 3Hz to reduce the time per session.  My feeling is that 4Hz is just fine.  As I noted in another post, my machine skips shocks at 6Hz.

While I was concerned at the end of round two, the significant improvement after round one happened in the three weeks following the final session, so I was still hopeful.  During the three weeks following round two, there was some improvement, but basically I was back where I was before I started SW.

After almost another week there was little, if any, additional improvement.  What happened?  My best guess is that the shocks caused cardiovascular trauma.  Basically, angiogenesis in reverse.  I had some fear that there was nerve damage, but as things have improved since then, this seems unlikely.

The machine giveth, and the machine taketh away.

Planning for Round Three

Almost four weeks after the end of round two, and my morning wood was more soggy cardboard than wood.  I figured if the damage was cardiovascular, then it could be repaired.  I would be more cautious this time.

For this round I am reducing energy level to 30mJ – down from my previous 90mJ.  I am reducing the number of shocks to 2400 – down from 3600.  Using a total of twelve locations to spread the shocks around was an experiment that I feel had a positive result.  So each location gets 200 shocks.

I also was going to allow a bit more time between sessions – five days.  Previously, I scheduled two sessions per week.  This is a more conservative plan.

Round Three

I am halfway through round three now.  Improvements have come.  Morning wood is back.  I’m not back to the level I was before I ran my SW program off the rails, but it looks like I’ll get there.   What is noticeable from the lower energy level is that I don’t have reduced sensitivity immediately following a session.  This suggests that the higher energy level caused trauma that the lower energy level does not.  I believe this is a good thing.

My mental metaphor – that SW is like weight training – you want as many sets and reps and as much weight as you can handle – was wrong.  Now I realize the therapy should have an objective of getting shocked just enough to promote growth and then letting the body heal itself, while staying well below a level that causes trauma.   There seems to be a wide range of SW programs that can do this.  But it is now clear to me that getting too aggressive with a program does more harm than good.

 

 

9/24/2019 6:23 am  #2


Re: Possibly useful info

Thanks for this detailed report Yobro!

 

9/24/2019 1:28 pm  #3


Re: Possibly useful info

Thank you so much Yobro! Your post is greatly appreciated.I am just beginning a program myself,and grateful for the experimentation and willingness to share.

 

9/29/2019 8:48 am  #4


Re: Possibly useful info

Thanks for your very detailed and helpful update Yobro - very interesting.

I have just completed my first round of treatment with no discernible result, so I’m wondering if I have my machine set up right. Possibly, I have been doing it too often and/or at too high a setting. Your conclusion that it is easy to ‘overdo it’ makes me think I might have the same problem...

 

10/04/2019 5:21 pm  #5


Re: Possibly useful info

I ran across this 2017 article from American Urology Daily news:
https://www.auadailynews.org/debate-continues-about-use-of-shockwave-therapy-to-treat-ed/

Arguing against the use of shockwave therapy for ED, Tom Lue, MD, professor and Vice Chair of Urology at the University of California, San Francisco, said he believes there are still too many unanswered questions regarding the optimal energy range, frequency of treatment and long-term effects that need to be answered before abandoning traditional treatment strategies.

“In shockwave therapy, the energy level is very important. At a certain level, you may have a beneficial effect. But if you gradually go higher, it’s less and less effective,” he said. “In fact, a 2008 study in animals showed that at higher levels, animals actually become impotent and it causes fibrosis. So, there’s some concern that, unless you know the ideal energy level and unless you can calculate the biologic effect, it’s not going to work and it may actually harm the patient.”

Last edited by Yobro (10/04/2019 5:21 pm)

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11/08/2019 2:32 pm  #6


Re: Possibly useful info

Hi guys!  It's time for another update.  I finished off my third round of six sessions, and five weeks have passed since then.  Improvements came, slowly.  As with my first round, a few weeks after the last session the improvements became most noticeable.

But the damage I did to myself in round two was significant, and four weeks after the last session my self-evaluation was I was below the improvement I had at the end of round one.  I was not quite ready to start blasting my penis with the machine again, but wanted to do something, and I came up with an idea.

The P.E. sites tout jelqing as a technique to improve erection quality as well as penis size.  The thought occurred to me that if SW indeed caused cardiovascular growth, then perhaps a follow-up program of jelqs might further improve blood flow.  And after a month layoff, most likely I was healed up enough so that jelqs would not do any damage.

So I tried it.  Soaped up in the shower, water turned off (water is precious here).  Two hundred slow strokes, trying to keep the glans engorged the whole time.  At the end my penis looked like a fat, pink cigar and stayed that way for awhile.  Definitely engorged.

After a few of days of this, my take so far is that there appears to be some synergy between SW and this follow-up program.  I'm going to continue this for at least another week or two, or as long as improvement keeps coming.  As a caution, I suspect that guys with venous leaks might cause further damage to themselves with this.  We all need to be careful!

Very preliminary, but perhaps a full cycle could look something like this:
1 month of SW treatment
1 month recovery
1 month jelqing

This would allow up to four cycles per year. Definitely stop should the unlikely occur - erections start tearing pants' fabric.  We can dream, can't we?
 

Last edited by Yobro (11/08/2019 2:47 pm)

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9/04/2020 12:10 pm  #7


Re: Possibly useful info

How about an update yobro.  Did SW with jelqing improve things.
 

 

9/06/2020 3:42 pm  #8


Re: Possibly useful info

I did an update covering my experience through March 2020 in another thread.  I'll post another update in that thread.

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